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Delia
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Dark elves

Postby Delia » Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:57 am

How do you guys see dark elves of Forostar as? The npc types mostly are of the "death to all heretics/fluffy goodness!" variety but...I am not sure if I can phrase the correct question here yet. There are also two distinct camps darkies who have offered themselves to different gods. How do you see them interacting with each other? It also seems to me that Sathonys usually drives towards killing stuff while with Lilith you have seemingly more choices to choose from. Different factions and regions seem to have differing amounts of tolerance towards dark elves as well. Any opinions about that?

I will be bluntly honest here. I have long since entertained a fantasy about Delia the dark elf and this is just that. Me entertaining myself with that fantasy. It might be that it will never happen...but if things someday take a sudden turn, it might be fun to take that ride. Anyways, shoot with what you've got!
"To be is to do" - Sokrates
"To do is to be" - Jean-Paul Sartre
"Do be do be do" - Frank Sinatra

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Delia
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Re: Dark elves

Postby Delia » Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:11 am

What happens inside an elf's head when the decision and the act itself is done? And how is it afterwards? I imagine it is more than going *SNAP*CRACKLE*POP* and "Rawr! I am a murderous bastard now!"

Also, are there any actual physical changes, or mental changes for that matter?
"To be is to do" - Sokrates

"To do is to be" - Jean-Paul Sartre

"Do be do be do" - Frank Sinatra

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luminier
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Re: Dark elves

Postby luminier » Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:26 am

It's all in your, like, mind, man.
The right man in the wrong place can make all the difference in the world.

fernao
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Re: Dark elves

Postby fernao » Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:01 am

As an actual darkelf I can tell you how it happened with me.
I was drifting towards the dark side, intrigued by it, but certain final decissions are just impossible as elf. Taniel has seen to THAT when he created the elves, thats why the "corrupting" influence of Lilith or Sathonys are needed. However, their support to go against Taniels will cemes at a heavy price, you strike a deal with them you cannot ever go back on. EVER!

There are physical changes when an elf turns into a darkelf, am not sure if also mental ones happen then. I am sure every southerner will tell you there are mental changes involved. I personally think the mental changes come first, driving you towards the goal of reaching those physical changes as well.

I personally would have prefered it if being darkelf would mean only a different set of mind, a different degree of freedom and NOT visible changes for the world to see. Would open a LOT of rp possibilities.
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Delia
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Re: Dark elves

Postby Delia » Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:12 am

Yea, the "a x,x,x darkelf enters" is a bummer. First thought that comes to mind is what was my quickest kill something command available.
"To be is to do" - Sokrates

"To do is to be" - Jean-Paul Sartre

"Do be do be do" - Frank Sinatra

Drayn
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Re: Dark elves

Postby Drayn » Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:52 am

I agree completely! Dark elves would be an ideal subversive character, something for the goodie goods to investigate.

I vaguely recall making a suggestion a long time ago that dark elves could perhaps generate some sort of less than obvious effect that they can't surpress; carry a disease that infects elves and is recognisable as "that illness that dark elves cause". The infection should remain dormant for a long time so it's very difficult to determine who is responsible for the outbreak and the disease should have a pretty low rate of contagion so not everyone catches it immediately and it can only be caught from the carrier. All that is known is that one amongst us is a dark elf! Every elf is potentially a suspect, let the witch trials commence!

There should be no certain means of knowing if a person is a dark elf or not, other than them admitting it, but there SHOULD be a way for elven society and/or the clergy of Taniel to brand someone as a dark elf, physically and permanently (or at least up until the mark is removed by some divine or magical means). That way there is loads of fun to be had with innocent elves wrongly convicted or genuine dark elves protesting their innocence.

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Delia
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Re: Dark elves

Postby Delia » Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:27 am

I am not a Cylon!
"To be is to do" - Sokrates

"To do is to be" - Jean-Paul Sartre

"Do be do be do" - Frank Sinatra

Zehren
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Re: Dark elves

Postby Zehren » Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:55 pm

This will be another of my boring posts. It was better written originally, but then I got logged out while writing. Ye gods.

To quote Christopher Lee pretending to be Saruman on film:
"Let us examine what we know."

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Darkelf NPCs are often the uninteresting slaughter-all kind. However, I do not think this dumb representation is representative of the darkelves. Indeed; darkelf PCs are usually much more nuanced, and there are other more nuanced darkelf NPCs as well. Smugglers, shopkeeps, assassins (assassination requiring quite a bit more elaborateness, being a change from "kill all, now" to "kill a select few, as efficiently as possible". As such, I believe the darkelf "race" can be portrayed as nuanced as any other. Surely, darkelf shoemakers have the same degree of skill as any other, despite working with dwarf intestines as material?


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Darkelves worship Lilith or Sathonys. There is as large a difference in philosophy between these two deities as between, say, Taniel and Evren, or Asral and Zhakrin. However, due to many monsters being of these faiths, there is a mental tendency to lop them together as 'those evil things'. At least I have noted this tendency in my own mind.


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As for physical changes: http://www.geas.de/?page_id=319&help=darkelf
[quote]Not really distinguishable otherwise from an elf, darkelves tend to have paler skin due to their increased nightly activity.[/quote]
This is in contrast to how some poDarkelves have RP'd. Byspel, at least one has RP'd an increase in muscular tissue. Of course, if the helpfile is not considered correct anymore, it ought be updated :lol:

However, according to helpfile, there are no physical changes - even the skin colour comes about only from lack of sunlight. (Ghouls are another matter, of course). This, then, raises the question of how to spot a darkelf? And why the race even shows up as darkelf - surely it would be more reflective to make them appear as elves in terms of keywords displayed?

One major point of debate is whether darkelves are sterile or not; some state they are, from the tidbit that darkelves are not born, but "made". However, if there are no physical changes, then this can be understood as darkelven genitalia and reproducing as identical to elven - no one is born a darkelf, as darkelves are elves who turn to the dark gods. Can a newborn elf turn to the dark gods? When can such things be carried out? How effective is such indoctrination?

And: If darkelves cannot breed, then there is a significant problem with numbers: where do they all pop up from.


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As darkelves are elves who turn to the dark gods, with no physical changes: is the ritual actually a transformation? Or a pact? or a cultural ritual with no actual content?


I can see two broad ways for an elf to become a darkelf: turning to Lilith; turning to Sathonys.

Lilith is chaos, darkness and blackfire: Byspel:
Bob the normative elf decides the life of an adventurer is for him, and is thus not that normative, I guess. He fletches a bow and some arrows and shoots some gobbers for the queen, returning the filthy, filthy scalpses. Then he sees others get dragged to the Tanielite cathedral for 'correction' after having too much skin on the scalps. Then he observes the council waste everyone's time and accomplish nothing. <insert dozens of similar hypocrisies here>. Bob realises order is a wasteful joke, and turns to the truth: Chaos.


Sathonys is death, death and destruction: Byspel:
Bob the other elf grieves as his cousins (all elves are cousins) are put in pain, and as he is put in pain. Illnesses strike, with no meaning. All that is built crumbles. Nothing lasts, nothing, except elven life. Elven life drags on and on and forever on. One night Bob finally lies down, sobbing in the earth as he grieves his lost cousins. It is all too much to bear. Then a slightly pale but otherwise entirely normal elven hand appears in his sight. A friendly voice speaks: "My master sees your pain and your anguish, cousin. He sees all the torment the self-righteous gods and goddesses of so-called good rain down on you and your kin. How they torture you, making you go on and on and on, ever back on the breaking wheel. My master grieves with you, but He is immensely powerful. He can take the grief. He offers you a way out, away from all this grief. Do not be troubled, cousin, the pain, the fear, it will all go away. The pain was multiplied thousandfold at the curse known only as Evren's curse. You know what it is, the so-called 'free will'. My master is willing to lift it from you; in return, He only wishes that you serve him in everything, forever." Bob takes the friendly hand.


I advocate slow changes above sudden turncloakry, though. It is more realistic a process, offers plenty of RP possibilities 'on the road', and leaves no one thinking of OOC factors. Allow me to paraphrase part of a very enjoyable conversation Zehren had with someone I will render anonymous and represent with 'A' (relevant to this last point, though not darkelvenry):

A: You have changed. When I see you, you are not the same as before - and not in a good way.
Z nods slowly.
Z: Yes, that sounds very probably. Surely, I have changed - had I not, then I would be stagnant and without motion; quite wasteful. As for whether this hypothetical change is benign or not I cannot say - I do know, however, that it oft takes numerous attempts ere arriving at the best. Perhaps you might enlighten me as to the nature of these changes?
A shakes head slowly.
A: No, I cannot. I am unable to set my finger on them exactly, but I feel them plainly and I do not like it.
Z: I see.

(If something is unclear, do not hesitate to point out/ask - some meaning might have gotten lost in my forced rewrite *grumble*)
Drayn wrote:Zehren, the Karmassassin!


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