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Combat specials for mounted fights

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fernao
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Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby fernao » Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:16 am

With a recent change none of the combat specials work while mounted anymore, at least not the type of mounts I used.
So, how about some new specials that work only while being mounted? Wouldn't that be something?

Depends of course on the amount of people actually fighting while mounted. But at least crusaders and partly sathos come to mind here.
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luminier
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby luminier » Wed Jan 15, 2014 4:23 pm

I've always felt that people who were fighting while mounted needs some kind of a buff especially against fighting someone on foot.

Headbutting, elbowing and bodychecking never made sense from horseback anyways. Specials that should still work are... impale, slam (maybe a check for a long weapon?) and shieldbash for sure.

I think a nice medium would be that when you type elbow or bodycheck it checks how well trained your mount is and then your mount does an attack that has a similar effect to elbow or bodycheck.

Also never understood why you can't charge if you are in combat, but, I guess the "realism line" needs to be drawn somewhere. Also I don't think that the game mechanics would make charging in combat simple.
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby ceinna » Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:45 pm

I agree with this entirely. I mean, I can fight unarmed on my horse against gremlins (which are pretty small comparatively) but I can't impale them with my spear. Just seems backwards and as it is, makes mounted combat far less enjoyable to be involved in as its pretty much attack and watch the screen scroll by.

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby ghalt » Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:08 am

I can certainly understand some things not working. You know, kick, knee, anything that would require fancy footwork or immediately hurl you off the horse and onto your face.

But if watching game of thrones and various terrible fantasy movies over the years has taught me anything it's that you can totally swing a sword or axe in wide arcs around you while horseback riding.

(Ceinna's point is terribly good, too, I think.)

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Drayn » Thu Jan 16, 2014 5:10 am

Just in the spirit of keeping the forums tidy, I wonder if this should be moved into the ideas section?

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Delia » Thu Jan 16, 2014 6:15 am

The game takea weapon length and compares heights when determining hit locations(or so I recall)so the logical solution would go from that and logically apply what goes and what does not. Reasonably enough you rarely can headbutt but there could be a dramatic chance for that(against an ogre or larger)but reasonably enough one should be able to punch, kick(ineffectively), slam, elbow, and impale atleast. Heck, i'd even allow backhand chops and battlescreams as well. Just check against riding/mounted combat for penalties and critical failures. Make it fun.
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Drayn » Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:15 am

Dunno about that; Drayn once headbutted a rat in the face :D

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Delia » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:39 am

Been there, done that :D

Obviously, headbutt should consider the height difference and disallow its use if there is no sense or apply equally catastrophic results to the user. For example receiving cuts and bruises or worse after taking a dive against the poor rat.
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Delia » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:41 am

Or just generate a missed result thus wasting the special.
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby mazarmormuk » Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:34 pm

i agree, too.

all specials gone makes fighting very boring.
can you still cast while mounting?

i see reality problems too on headbutt, knee and kick, and there might be a balance issue that explains the denial of all specials in mounted combat, but i think there are more interresting ways to solve that, if.

maybe a wielded twohander is a bit of a reality problem, too.

so i ld suggest, as others before, a headbutt fail if the enemy is too small, all leg specials disabled, maybe (for balance resaons) one hand for the mount and one hand for the weapon, and additional mount special(s) like a mount bodycheck or a charge in direct combat, which is realistic.

the issue mounted combat leaves a lot of additional variety and is generally fun, which seems now more reduced than developed

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby luminier » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:45 pm

So I logged on today and tried fighting while mounted, and Ceinna was definitely right it's pretty boring. Also makes the very difficult to learn "mounted combat" skill much less useful.

Why was this changed with no fun replacement in store?
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Drayn » Wed Feb 12, 2014 7:02 pm

How about some specific mounted specials:

Rear: Causes your mount to rear up on its back legs and strike an opponent, possibly knocking them down, at the risk of you being thrown out of the saddle.

Trample: Used on prone foes, you ride your mount over them and stamp them causing massive damage.

Joust: Wielding a long weapon like a spear or lance, you level the end of the weapon at your foe and charge them with results similar to impale and the chance of knocking mounted foes to the ground.

Back kick: Your mount strikes out with their hind leg for a powerful strike.

Broadside: You steer your mount in front of your group, giving the rest of the group cover, becoming the target of melee attacks and making ranged attacks against your party more difficult, though easier against your mount.

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luminier
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby luminier » Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:37 pm

those all sound awesome and would make mounted fighting fun!

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Skragna » Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:17 pm

Also like to offer up specials for the appropriate type of mount, since obviously wargs cannot rear up and kick... or effectively trample.


Worry - The toothed mount leaps onto a fallen target and begins to tear at them, causing massive amounts of bleeding.

Pounce - The predecessor to Worry, Pounce has the mount leap at the foe with its claws, trying to bring them down. Deals minimal damage, but has a very good chance of knocking a target down.

Hamstring - The toothed mount dips under the target's defenses and snaps at the back of its legs, seeking to cripple its movement. Causes a decent amount of bleeding, to boot.

Ravage - The toothed mount attempts to grab onto the target's extremities and rip them apart. (Think police dogs bringing down a target) Good damage, low chance of knockdown.

And for the unicorn...

Give them the ability to use impale/gore. I mean, they have a horn and all...

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Drayn » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:41 am

A large wolf could totally rear up and trample. I've seen large enough dogs do it. In a wargs case, trampling would be less stampy and more clawy, but the principle is essentially the same :) You could just substitute less damage for more bleeding.

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Skragna » Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:14 am

I dunno, though. That doesn't... quite seem like trampling, y'know?

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby ceinna » Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:05 pm

I don't know, I agree with Drayn. I've seen big dogs trample things quiet effectively.

I just want mounted combat to be more fun, I find it crazy that my little elf is vaulting on and off her horse mid combat to do specials (something that is possible - I used to do vaulting on horseback when I was younger), but still is rather frustrating in a game and defeats the purpose of a mounted combat skill in the first place in my opinion.

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Drayn » Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:22 pm

Skragna wrote:I dunno, though. That doesn't... quite seem like trampling, y'know?


True, but they're as close enough that the skills would be the same. It's always best to keep things simple where possible, the same way that there is just one punch skill rather than upper cut, haymaker, hook punch, hammer punch, spin punch and so on.

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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby luminier » Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:23 pm

Reading all this mount stuff gets my insides all warm.

I hope others agree with us =D
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Re: Combat specials for mounted fights

Postby Skragna » Thu Feb 13, 2014 1:18 pm

I suppose. Though I think punch should be a bit more deadly if you've got wargloves or gauntlets on. I can take a hit from anyone I've met, and have from a good few, and sure it hurts, but I've also been clipped on the chin by a guy wearing a gauntlet, and that one just 'bout put me to sleep. For mounts though, I guess that yeah, trampling works for warg, but I'd still love to see all those other abilities for them too.


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